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Good argument. I’d like to see what happens to the bill in the senate.

P.S. Love the blog name and allusion! 🙂

Adria — I admit I have not followed this, and that I published this to glean from Travis his insights into the issue as a whole and not with regard to this particular issue. However, according to my read of the congressional record, this still is alive in the senate.

The previous post was Gail’s opinion. I am not speaking for my spouse. G

This was a thoughtful article. Thanks for posting it, Randy!For those of you who have not had the opportunity, the letters written by Ted and Gayle Haggard that were read at New Life Church on Sunday can be found here:http://tinyurl.com/ymbezehttp://tinyurl.com/yb7pv5I was encouraged by reading them, and pray that what would appear to be real repentance and dedication to the Lord will indeed be the case during what must surely be a painful ordeal ahead of repentance and death to self.I am reminded of the old saying that the Church is the only army that shoots its own wounded…I am also reminded that we, in the church, should be unsurprised when such things happen: heart-broken, but unsurprised. There but for the grace of God would go any of us.Chris

Is there any way to put the date on comments and not only the time?

One thing that I appreciate about this whole situation with Haggard is that it shows that even ministers are people who need the grace and mercy of God. They aren’t somehow less vulnerable to sin or more holy than the average Joe because of their position. What Ted Haggard did was wrong but what he is doing about it is real Christianity. He admits his wrong without excuses and seeks forgiveness. May God help the Church to not be too quick to judge.Tom

Gus — I think I’ve set it up now so that the date appears with the time. We’ll see. Still learning.

I think I’ve fixed it.

Tom,This post was a test to see if anyone was out there. My tree fell in the forest, and lo and behold, it made a noise. Imagine that.Ironically, I just got off the phone after a lengthy conversation on this subject. I am trying to determine the degree to which I am and am not comfortable with the Confession’s statement on worship. My conclusion at this point is quite similar to your own. As proof, I quote here what I wrote just prior to looking at your comment:”I do believe that worship that is Scriptural will have singing, praying, preaching, and sacraments, and I believe that such worship will be God centered, reverent, and beautiful. These things I think are true to Scripture. As to how such beauty, reverence, and God centeredness is maintained and developed, that is a question of wisdom that the leaders of each worshiping community need to decide. That is the way in which I believe Scripture regulates worship.”This is, I think, at a minimal level at least, in agreement with the Confession, though not with some of the Confession’s more strident apologists.Thanks for dropping in!

Hmm- we have heard good things about “Stranger than Fiction.” Have you seen “Deja Vu”? We are wondering if it is worth the effort.Thanks for being our film critic! And do you think it shows our age when getting to a movie is an “effort”?!Chris

The beauty the Mac is that underneath all of the pretty stuff that makes OS X enjoyable and easy to use, the foundation is the uber-geeky Free BSD operating system. Granted, the average user neither knows or cares, but for someone who does care (a.k.a. me), there’s a wealth of opportunity for tinkering around.What’s nice though, is that with my Mac, I can tinker when I want to, on my terms, whereas when I was running Windows most of my tinkering came from fixing things that would break at the worst possible times and for no readily apparent reason

I got was able to retreive the link 🙂 I had already heard this as an MP3 file you sent me some time ago. Sounds like fun!Chris

I don’t really care all that much. 🙂 May the best man win. What’s the bet?

Welcome back, Randy-The “two” have spoken 😉

Condolences to Jeff on the UNC loss. Dave is currently beating me by 3 points…

OK- as the dubious “one” person who hated Eternal Sunshine, I feel somewhat compelled to explain what ellicited such a response from me. But realize that I only saw it once, and often my opinion gets highly refined after a second viewing. Also, it was a couple of years ago I think, so my mind is foggy on the details.Dave and I watched it with our college-aged sons, Ben and Tim, who both liked it immensely. I guess I felt that the junk one had to wade through (language, nudity–or near nudity, drug junk, etc.) was simply not worth it for the message delivered. While I agree that it raised interesting questions, its answers were implied and vague, and not “enough” in my opinion to make wading through the garbage worth it. What answers did it give? Love, even flawed, is better than nothing? ugh… And light-hearted? Really? I thought it was utterly depressing.I don’t think I am a prude. I don’t think I’m looking to have my own worldview verified. I think I am asking the question, how big must the gem be in order to make it worth raking through so much muck? I ask this not only when film-viewing, but when reading, too. Sometimes the violence, hopelessness, nihilism, etc., is integral to the gem of wisdom buried beneath. But what did Eternal Sunshine have to share?I think the balance we as believers try to strike between engaging culture and yet not being “of it” is pretty tricky. I think using our legitimate Christian liberty is tricky, because I know my own heart is utterly capable of excusing its sin and claiming to be purer in its motivation than it is in reality. How can, then, a young man or woman keep his or her way pure in this world? How’s that for a thought provoking question…Chris, ducking in NM…

Thanks for taking up the challenge I threw at you. I am new to this blog thing, and probably should take care that I not be seen as being critical of you. Your comments are well taken, and I regret stirring you up so much that you devoted worthy time to a self defense that at this point maybe three people will actually see… 🙂 I often myself wonder if I am deadened to some things because of the assault on my senses by movies and the like. However, and this is the key, your sons loved “Eternal Sunshine.” Why? It was not because of the near nudity, drug junk, etc. of course. It may be because that they, being younger, think differently than you do. Art, and film is an art, gives us a window of understanding that now and then we need to peer into. I’ve seen a number of movies which I did not like, yet which, though pushing me to the edge of what I can tolerate, have provided such a window. A young man I met who is working on a Ph.D. in literature said that “Fight Club” was a movie that greatly resonated with his generation. I watched it, and much of it I did not enjoy. At points I grimaced. But it resonates with a portion of the people among whom I am to minister. What does this film say about them? Perhaps a great deal if I am willing to listen. Our conversation was enriched because he was astounded that I had been willing to watch movies that meant something to HIM.What answers do movies give? They give the answers that our culture can give, often inadequate. But they form a part of the language of our culture which I believe we need to learn to speak.There is a lot more that I want to say, but as is usual, I know that we are not really that far apart in our thinking. Thanks for your challenge. I hope you still love me!

I may not be chiming in, but I am listening…. 🙂

Hey, I have continued pondering this question. Are you tired of dealing with it yet? Let me know if you are, and I will let it die.Does art have any responsibility to be normative? By that I mean, does art have any responsibility to point towards the good, the true and the beautiful as what should be, rather than only portraying what is? I am having some incipient thoughts here that I am not finding good words to express yet(at least new and beginning for me, though I suspect that if I took more time to read abut aesthetics, I would find the exact words I need from the writings of others.)I know it is good to appreciate the talents and gifts of others, even when they don’t use them to glorify God consciously– all truth is God’s truth, etc. But I don’t buy the “art for art’s sake” argument any more than I buy anything else existing in some moral vacuum where it is an entity unto itself with no responsibilities to the culture at large. So my question is, what responsibility does the film artist have for presenting normative truth versus reflecting fallen reality? Is he free of the responsibility when, possibly coincidentally or unintendedly, the way “truth” is presented in his film becomes normative for the culture that views it? And again, I struggle with the question of by what standard should we judge the worth of what we are willing to wade through for the sake of enjoying art? How seriously and in what ways do we have an obligation to keep our eyes, ears, etc. from evil? I have had a friend who is film student and lover and amater maker, who makes a distinction between sex and violence in films. Her point, not original with her, but likely “borrowed” from Brian Godawa, is that violence is a public sin which we are all exposed to, and so it is open to public viewing and treatment in film. However, sex is a private thing: it is to be private, and when sexual sins take place, they are private, and never to be open for “viewing”. She makes the point that when violence is portrayed in film, it is always “make believe”, and the actors are not really harmed. But when sex/nudity is portrayed, the actors cannot help but be violated, and neither can the viewers. I find this an interesting distinction, but I may have asked enough questions for today…Chris, pondering in NM

Amen and amen…The sermon by John Chrysostom has been sent to me twice in the last two days, so I post is here as further reflection…Easter SermonJohn Chrysostom (349-407)Is there anyone who is a devout lover of God?Let them enjoy this beautiful bright festival!Is there anyone who is a grateful servant?Let them rejoice and enter into the joy of their Lord!Are there any weary with fasting? Let them now receive their wages!If any have toiled from the first hour, let them receive their due reward;If any have come after the third hour, let him with gratitude join in the Feast!And he that arrived after the sixth hour, let him not doubt; for he too shall sustain no loss.And if any delayed until the ninth hour, let him not hesitate; but let him come too.And he who arrived only at the eleventh hour, let him not be afraid by reason of his delay.For the Lord is gracious and receives the last even as the first.He gives rest to him that comes at the eleventh hour, as well as to him that toiled from the first.To this one He gives, and upon another He bestows.He accepts the works as He greets the endeavor.The deed He honors and the intention He commends.Let us all enter into the joy of the Lord! First and last alike receive your reward; rich and poor, rejoice together!Sober and slothful, celebrate the day!You that have kept the fast, and you that have not, rejoice today for the Table is richly laden!Feast royally on it, the calf is a fatted one.Let no one go away hungry. Partake, all, of the cup of faith.Enjoy all the riches of His goodness!Let no one grieve at his poverty, for the universal kingdom has been revealed.Let no one mourn that he has fallen again and again; for forgiveness has risen from the grave.Let no one fear death, for the Death of our Savior has set us free.He has destroyed it by enduring it.He destroyed Hades when He descended into it.He put it into an uproar even as it tasted of His flesh.Isaiah foretold this when he said,”You, O Hell, have been troubled by encountering Him below.”Hell was in an uproar because it was done away with.It was in an uproar because it is mocked.It was in an uproar, for it is destroyed.It is in an uproar, for it is annihilated.It is in an uproar, for it is now made captive.Hell took a body, and discovered God. It took earth, and encountered Heaven.It took what it saw, and was overcome by what it did not see.O death, where is thy sting?O Hades, where is thy victory?Christ is Risen, and you, o death, are annihilated!Christ is Risen, and the evil ones are cast down!Christ is Risen, and the angels rejoice!Christ is Risen, and life is liberated!Christ is Risen, and the tomb is emptied of its dead;for Christ having risen from the dead,is become the first-fruits of those who have fallen asleep.To Him be Glory and Power forever and ever. Amen!

Agree with Randy and Stacy that love alone is not enough to stay married. Emerson Eggerichs titles his introduction to _Love and respect_ “Love alone is not enough”. The book’s subtitle is: the love she most desires, the respect he desperately needs. The book is about obeying Ephesians 5.33.

Gail here. You and Barb are cute as as a button–or, is it buttons? Thanks for those thoughts on marriage which was a timely reminder for me of the line we tacked on to the end of our wedding vows nearly 34 years ago, “with Jesus Christ continuing to be the foundation of our lives together.” G

Remember this as you spend time around me and talk to me over the next couple of months dad. Remember your many prayers and mine as well. Then see God’s amazing blessings which none of us deserve. Love you!

This subject raises conflicting emotions in me. On the one hand, you write “One can be humble…and never have a quiet time.” That gives me an excuse for laxity. (I realize that is not your intention.)On the other, you write about the benefits of QT; then I feel guilty when I neglect this spiritual disclipine and virtue.–ae

Woo Hoo! I finally not only “get it”, but I finally “did it”! This RSS for Dummies was exactly what I needed. Thanks, Ole Buddy, Ole Pal! 🙂

The problem with all the techies in my family is that the ones that are young and probably “get” it are the ones that are now pretty much gone from home 🙁 My old techie is too busy…

Chris, the key word in my statement and the author of the blog in question is ‘all’. No one is suggesting we abandon Christian relationships and friendships. But as we say about so many things, when a good thing becomes the only thing it becomes a bad thing. Most Christians I know are not in danger of abandoning their Christians friends for non-Christians friends. It is the opposite problem we confront. Jesus was known as a friend of sinners. I am not sure too many of the people I know (me included) could be convicted on such a charge.

It is definitely my experience that there is no correlation between my behavior and my quiet time. Often, I sin magnificently on days when I have had fabulous quiet times. Other days, I feel closer to God than ever before and I realize I didn’t have a quiet time that morning. Where I do see the correlation is wanting more of His Word when I do have a quiet time. When I heed the call of the alarm and I start meditating on a passage, I never, ever want to stop. I’m never looking at the clock saying, “Man, when is this hour going to be over so I can stop?” When I’m in the thick of it, I always want more. Such experiences should make me jump up at the call of the alarm EVERY morning, but consistency is a constant battle for me. So, I guess what I’m saying is that quiet times really do “put me in the way of grace.” When I’m in the “way” (i.e. a quiet time), I’m experiencing “grace” (wanting more of Him). It is only when I’m exercising the spiritual discipline that I want Him more. Because it is clear that when I’m not in the “way”, I’m not necessarily apt to want more of Him on the merits of my own thoughts about Him.My friend Margie and I have somewhat heated discussions about this topic regularly. She won’t make any decisions unless she is “prayed up” as she says and she seems to just freeze and fall apart if she doesn’t have a quiet time. I tell her it is becoming a work in her life. She tells me I don’t put enough importance on it. I think the spiritual discipine of quiet time is really important, but my sinful nature really battles a seven-day a week consistency with it.So, thanks for putting it that way – that it puts us in the way of grace. I heard you say that in a past Sunday School class, but I didn’t really think about it much until I read this blog.Staci, who will once again beg and plead at the throne of God tonight to help her wake up at 4:30 so she can have a quiet time in the morning…

It scares me from time to time how similar our thought patterns are, I do however think it is a good thing. Great blog and I will tell “my good friend” she is famous =)

She didn’t buy the dress to wear at graduation, she had a graduation so she could buy a dress…. silly father…

Hi, Randy.Good to “see” you here.– Phil

Hey Randy,Sounds like you learned a lot this week with Colin. You are right that trust is learned. Colin, in a mysterious way, does trust God. He does have faith, and that faith will grow through time as he is nurtured in the covenant community. God is his God just as He promised you, and you can be assured of that fact, even though Colin is still young. He will not belong to God any less or more when he is older. Sounds hard to believe, but we should believe it.

Someone beat me to it! :-(It is also sitting on my shelves, only glanced at. But then, I hold to the attitude expressed by Roger Nicole when he was asked about his rather extensive (4,000+ volume) library…”Books are to be referenced, not read…”:-)Chris

Don’t feel bad, Chris, it was only 6 minutes! BTW it’s not “Charity and its Fruits.”

Yes, do keep it going! And, we’ll refer others. Now, let me figure out how to do that! G

Great-it’s unanimous!I currently subscribe to 4 Blogs which I thoroughly enjoy.One, is obviously yours and another is a photo-journalist, who is also a Christian. The other blogs are by a shepherdess and last but not least…an Australian artist who lives in Tuscany, Italy. When time allows, I enjoy reading these blogs for the following reasons; I am encouraged by the Christians who post and are willing to share a little bit about themselves and what God is teaching them etc. Although the other blogs might be written by non-Christians??, I am continually entertained by their comments and very interested in the information they share related to my topic of interest…(not to mention their photos and pictures of their art work!). Although I am only a “spectator” when it comes to blogging (this is my first comment ever!), I have come to appreciate the time and effort that must be involved, in creating not only an attractive post, but most importantly, an informative and interesting one! When the situation arises, I will gladly recommend your blog to my friends! Keep them coming!

yes – keep on keeping on; we enjoy reading – we read all your posts – tho’ we don’t comment frequently. you know we’ve spread the word half way round the world.

Okay, okay, okay. All my friends say keep at it. If my Mom was still alive, she’d probably say the same thing. Some of you I did not know were reading still, so this is good to know. You guys are a huge encouragement to me. Thanks.

There may not be a grand-daughter if her daughter or daughter-in-law has an abortion.

What effect really does presidential politics have on this issue? We’ve had Reagan and two Bushes since Roe and still have abortion. Greater impact comes as people’s minds are changed at ground level — perhaps even through side comments in the occasional novel. Would I vote for Guliani? When the time comes, it will depend upon the choices.

As heart-wrenching and traumatic as the death of a newborn is, I think it must be equally difficult – if not more so – for a woman to place her child for adoption. My heart also aches for the grandparents who “have a grandchild but don’t have a grandchild.”I agree that women who choose life and adoption for their pre-born babies are to be greatly admired for that decision. –adri

Oh – and did you know? — Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana.–ae

So, I have a book to reccomend. I have only read part of it, but what I have read I found fascinating. I have also heard one of the authors (Scot Roley) speak. I highly reccomend this book.God’s Neighborhood: A Hopeful Journey in Racial Reconciliation and Community Renewal by Scott Roley, James Isaac Elliott, and Michael Card (Paperback – Jun 2004) Adria

This website is a great resource:WWW.SERMONAUDIO.COMHere are some sermons, somewhat related to your topic:The Problem of Violence by Dr. Frank McClelland (03/14/2004)God Knows Our Hearts, also by Dr. Frank McClelland (11/22/1998)The Duty of Impartiality in the Treatment of Others – 11 byMr. David McClelland (04/17/2005)Love for Neighbors – 21 also by David McClelland (09/17/2006)A Christian View of Gov’t.& Politics #5: Gov’t & Race Relations by Dr. Stacey H. Taylor |(02/11/2005)Life-Giver: Valuing People by Stacey M. Cox (05/14/2006)

It would be hard to top “Amusing Ourselves to Death”. However “Bridge” is provocative and poses some challenges for how to do ministry in the current age. He is not a Christian, and he places too much confidence in the rationalism of those who have gone before us. However, it is a good book. I do recommend it.

I believe there has to be commitment for there to be a progressive and successful relationship, within the church community.I also realize that it’s not always easy to have everyone ‘on board’ because we are all so different: e.g. personalities, cultural backgrounds, how we were raised (meaning what values are important to us), different levels of Christian maturity and development, not to mention what is going on in our personal lives, and what our needs might be etc., and although these factors might not dictate as to how we will commit to a particular church community, they can influence our decisions and our level of commitment. So in answer to your question: ‘Mutual promise’…”Is this what it takes to establish, build & maintain community?I believe boasting about one’s commitment in a marriage, doesn’t let one off the hook. It’s whether or not a person is fully engaged in, or involved in the relationship, not to mention the depth of their love for the other person. If not, you are just biding time. Thus, the same principle applies to the church community. [This is a big topic, so trying to condense my answer is proving to be quite difficult.]:) The reality is, we live in a society today that if certain conditions are not met within a relationship (whether personal or public) people tend to step out or leave quite easily, BUT true commitment (I believe) is being involved, being faithful, being consistent and being loyal EVEN when it is difficult. I believe obedience (to God) and LOVE should be at the basis of our personal relationships and also our relationships within our church community. ALTHOUGH, I do recognize that if there is only one person in the relationship who is commited and shares these beliefs, disagreements can sometimes become more serious, which is the same for the church. IF, after prayer and genuine effort to try to come to an agreement on things and conflict is starting to fray a person’s relationship with other church members, then perhaps it’s time for that person to go somewhere else. How one leaves a church under these conditions, is also a way for one to demonstrate Christian maturity and grace, instead of going off like a school kid in a huff. In summary(lol), what Michael Card proposed with his group of friends is quite noble, but I’m not sure that agreeing to not move within a certain time frame, is a realistic goal, especially when it comes to a large number of people within a church setting.I do admire them though for their perseverance and their COMMITMENT! 🙂

Randy,You are exactly correct. I don’t think that God has finished saving people in this area! There are still ‘sheep not yet of this fold’ in Bradenton. So there are those out there for whom Christ will be welcomed more preciously than a cinnamon roll. At the same time, they may not welcome Him as quickly. People may not see their need for Christ right away, but they might see the need for justice in the world, security, purpose, meaning, community-all of which Christ is the answer. I think these are like the aroma of the cinamon roll. And people usually smell before buying. Once they see that the smell is really coming from the roll (gospel), those whom God has called WILL go all in.

Man’s inhumanity to man has always been a source of fear/horror for me. The princes and principalities of the air do not elicit that same emotion because I know who my Deliverer is. In Him there is peace. G

“Fair and biblical way” as in “May God smite my enemy”? Or the mark of Cain?Seems the more interesting question is how have so many Christians been deceived by this war criminal administration? Or why are the mechanics of “pious fraud” so easy because the pious are so easily manipulated?Have to wonder.Hi, Randy. Email me if you want.phlbbrtn@gmail.comWe could try to catch up after 24 years. Just a thought.Phil

I got to know a very nice 70+ year old lady through a project she wanted us to do at work (now lets me call her Grandma Dunwoody, and she calls me her granddaughter), but one time she was visiting my office, and a white man came in and I was very accomodating with him and practically bent over backwards to schedule an appointment for him with my boss, and I shook his hand before he left. After he left, she told me, “You never shook my hand when I first came in, that’s because of this,” and she tugged on her brown skin. I got a sick feeling in the pit of my stomach and I wanted to hide under my desk, because in the back of my mind I knew she was right. I may not hate black people, but I hadn’t started viewing (…and maybe still haven’t) blacks as my 100% equals. I realized that I was gregarious and excessively accomodating to the white visitors in my office, but I didn’t extend the same courtesies to our black visitors. And this was just last year.

This is the very kind of observation that we are wanting to fuel the sessions we do. Mental judgments based upon race impact even the best of us. Thanks for sharing this.

I agree with your main point here, Randy: we need to be able to communicate to our own generation in a way that it can understand. The truth of the gospel is clear in all generations: surely we can communicate that clearly!On the other hand, however, we are a people who have in many ways followed our culture’s obsession with visual imagery and sound-bites, and forgotten that we are called to be people of the Word. God chose to communicate to us most clearly through that medium of the written word. That should change the way we think about language, with its abilities and potentialities, and cause us to question our investment in it, or lack thereof. I sometimes see in myself the pull to watch the movie instead of read the book because it is easier. But the medium *is* in some ways, the message. Movies are excellent tools of communication, as are other forms of visual art, but they don’t communicate in the same way literature does. If we all fail to make the investment needed to learn from literature, we are all the poorer for it. And Edwards is a good example. I think it is a noble and worthy goal to make accessible a current and relevant book on marriage in a readily accessible style. But let’s also encourage one another to mine the depths of Edwards, or possibly a book from 1842 on marriage if its content is worthy. Like classical music or fine art, the more you are exposed to its depth and riches, the more accessible its style may become.

I don’t believe the age of the words should be the basis of our judgment of a book. If the author speaks [the] truth, that truth will carry through the generations.The pastor overseeing the counseling must see something in this older book. Perhaps its something that can be uniquely applied by this couple. Assuming he as suggested the book before, he is probably not oblivious to this issue of “relatability”. I would be interested to know what denomination (one area where I’m pessimistic) and what book it was.I don’t mean to take up an antagonistic view but I think we can miss out on a lot if we make judgments based on what things sound like or look like in stead of what they say. I’m not saying accept, I’m saying judge.In the grand scheme of things 1842 wasn’t that long ago. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1842. When I have questions or doubts about marriage the book I turn to again and again was written probably closer to 42.

I think you have some good thoughts. My buddy told me that the guy who oversees RUF ministries once said that one time each year tons of our neighbors actually come to us. It’s Halloween. Does it make sense to close our doors to them? I’m looking forward to the few who actually come to my doors, in hopes I can meet their parents and offer a last minute invitation to my neighborhood cookout. I just printed out a few more for this occasion.

Well Pastor Greenwald I am glad to see you’ve gotten yourself a blog! I always thought you would be good with a blog. How are things at Hope going along? How is the family? Things here in mississippi are well as we are leaving *hopefully* very soon! I will look forward to coming by and reading your stuff. We think of the church often, give our love to everyone.The Hatfields

Wow. I had never even heard of the film. But I usually don’t hear about them until they drop into my price range! I can spend 6-7 bucks on a movie or spend that amount on fishing lures-which last a few hours longer!Regardless, I hope that Christians can intelligently dialog with others and ask questions with our neighbors instead of just picketing and protesting movies. However, parents ought to be very discerning. But like the Da Vinci code, I imagine that it could produce some good dialog that wouldn’t have normally been had. That film had Christians scared, and it probably did more good than harm. Christ’s church still moved forward.

So, are the Christians who are ready to protest (I too have gotten the e-mails)falling into the stereotype the author presented as the Magisterium- are we guilty of an media inquisition?Sadly, we often do much to maintain the rep of those who are just out to make others miserable instead of revealing the “sweetness and excellency” of Christ.

I am obsessive, that I readily admit. But when I say ‘eight drafts’, that does not mean I have eight fully written statements to edit and post. It means I have scribbled down the basic ideas for eight posts. I also admit that I must read and rewrite what I post before I hit the ‘publish’ button to avoid great embarrassment. My initial work can often be ludicrous. (And I do need to exercise some care. I mean, after all, there may be professional writers out there reading my blog….)That all said, your advice is wise. “Let ‘er rip.” Now that sounds fun. My angst is not really about blogging, but about the basic use of my time, which for me is always a tension. (You should see my e-mail ‘to reply’ mailbox. Stuffed full. People all over waiting for replies from me.)So, I need to hit a rhythm, and will do so. Soon. Maybe.Hmmm. Maybe blogger should change the button labeling from ‘Publish’ to ‘Let ‘er Rip’!rrg

you post that and expect us to listen to a serious sermon two days later??? Ha!Ha!ae

Pfft! I’m old but I can still count; I should have know better than to comment before breakfast and when my bg was already a bit low. But, knowing you, even if I say three days… you’ll probably arrange for Geoff to preach on Sunday. — ae

I haven’t laughed that hard in…well, I don’t know that I have!

So great to see the whole family. Congrats on the future additional Greenwalds! Your post reminded me- We met you guys after Thanksgiving weekend- you and Barb invited us over for an impromptu lunch of leftover turkey sandwiches after church. You pulled out your giant table- great fellowship! One question- how does an introverted mom of four young children recharge? Please address this issue in your next post. 🙂

I laugh at the “Kidstoned” commercial, and at Staci’s “coffee” comment. As an extrovert, I may not be the best to suggest anything… but time with the Lord in peace and quiet seems only to happen for any of us early or late, and that seems important for all of us as moms, either introverts or extroverts.I would also suggest you look for ways to keep your schedule simple, and train even the littles among your kids that everyone in the house has “quiet” time: a time when, for 10 minutes at first, and then larger mounts of time, everyone is expected to be quiet in ones own bed (sleeping, looking at books, or other quiet, individual activities). I used this, and have known lots of moms of big families for whom this was a precious quiet break in the day!And when I needed to recharge and couldn’t seem to find the time or opportunity to do it, I tried to remember that the Lord brings rest when we need it, and if He wasn’t bringing it, I probably didn’t need it as much as I thought I did. :-)Praying for you today-Chris in NM

Today I ran across another reference to this:http://beyondourreach.blogspot.com/2007/12/uganda-update-and-call-to-prayer.htmlPraying-Chris in NM

Hurrah! Welcome back!

Make it 80% (4 out of 5)!

hooray, i was wondering when you were going to write something again!

No, not that kind of emerging.I guffawed, seriously, when I read that.

Happy Birthday Barb!Wow! We share the same birthdate!…Although I’m only 29! ;-)Hope you’re being spoiled today!(Pass this message on, eh!)Cheers,Fiona

*mush, mush*

Happy birthday, Barb!I like you being 32 because of what that makes me :-)Love,Chris

I want to intrude on a date night…watch movies and go to Starbucks to talk…What fun!

I think that’s a good assessment of the traditional/modern/seeker friendly sort of situation as it relates to the religous climate we’re in. Since people aren’t seeking out churches, the style of the church isn’t important–it’s more the people that are in it, and that issue forth from it. As people go forth from the church and encounter people outside of it, that’s the more meaningful reflection of the Body of Christ that people are looking at when they think of Christians. If there are authentic people and relationships to be had, and they are truly seeking Christ (or initially just some kind of meaning in life), I really don’t think they care if the church is contemporary or traditional.

Hey Randy,Interesting topic. I agree with you that the issue is not so much traditional vs contemporary, but that our society in general simply does not see church as a necessity. Perhaps that’s where we need to begin thinking: how do we make them see their need? I also agree with Rebekah and Gail. Individual christians need to be good neighbors, good friends, good workers, good citizens, good people. If they like us, and we are a reflection of our church, then they may like our church as well.Tom

And I say “traveling” because I know that we’ve neither arrived nor will the path be free of valleys. . .

Like the book – and the boy’s name of course 😉 – as well as your analogy and the lessons you’ve been taught and then shared with your readers. Yes the story is easier than Crime and Punishment.ae

Thanks for your post, Randy. Even in the midst of the Terrible, Horrible, No Good, Very Bad Day, (or weeks) when my emotions are all over the place and ready to fly apart like a too tightly wound clock, I can rest in God’s Word. Emotions are tricky, but God is my rock, the one constant, unchanging truth in a sea of turmoil. G (Preached that to myself this week)

Thanks, Randy! You are too kind. I’m glad you’ve enjoyed the blog, hopefully both of your readers will too. : )Keith

My book stack and Amazon wish list are always much bigger than my eyes and time. . .”Little Britches” by Ralph MoodyI’m reading aloud to the boys before we go to Colorado. . . I remember finding it on my grandmother’s shelf and my Dad reading it to us. It’s a good read aloud for your two younger ones (I was your daughter’s age one of the times Dad read it to us.)

The first 3 that came to my mind:”That Distant Land” by Wendell Berry.”Confessions of a Reformission Rev” by Mark Driscoll.”Planting Missional Churches” by Ed Stetzer.

I never should have asked. My lists just grow longer…Thanks for the suggestions thus far. I do confess to initially misreading Tulipgirl’s title and wondering what in the world her father read to her when she was a girl.:-) But I’ve corrected my mistake.Keep the suggestions coming.

Interestingly I just ran across Tim Keller’s Suggested Summer Reading.

This link fits right in with the “Summer” reading recommendations.”http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/18/opinion/18wed3.html?ref=opinionThe article “Reading Into the Future” is by Eleanor Randolph. In the event the link doesn’t work, you can find it on the New York Times site. I’m with the author, I like to get my hands on book books, not e-books. G

“(he will never like gardening and I will never enjoy list checking)”… Who does that sound like???

Enjoy your wonderful family time!

Laughing with you! The ending paragraphs seem to say that the old adage is still true: “The way to a man’s (boy’s) heart is through his stomach.” Plus, some of us have experienced the fact that teenage boys have hollow legs. –ae

Let me speak up for close-knit families who got there without camping.:) It’s wonderful to be at a family reunion with 50+ folk ages less than a year to nearly 80 (or 90+ when Grandma/Great Grandma was still with us.)We often reflect on Psalm 16:6 – “The lines have fallen to me in pleasant places; Yes, I have a good inheritance.” I suppose David had in mind more heavenly thoughts, but there’s no denying a congenial family group is a great gift from a loving Father.ae

Thanks for this review. The nature of false worship leads to the same place. Both looking for their own treasure and both finding in the end what they were looking for. They got what they wanted but what they wanted was not good. Have you seen Magnolia? (one of the roughest and crudest movies ever so be careful) but with a redemptive point… TWBB to me is his sequal to that movie… if at all possible.I am not offended by his portrait of the preacher because it is helpful to me to see how selfish ambition and vain conceit (phil 2:3) affect all. This entire movie is a picture of the insanity of sin.

Three cheers for Freddy the Pig! He is great fun. Freddy Goes to Florida I’ve read more than once, but have equally enjoyed other of his adventures. –ae

Cool! Honestly, one of the draws to my previous coffee joint (now Bella in Sarasota) was the free wifi. I took all my online exams there. (Less distracting than home.)

I’m not sure two hours would enable you to take your exams at Starbucks! Stumbled across a Chik-fil-A in Atlanta that offered free wifi. I’m now hoping the Creekwood CFA will pick up on that idea!And, yes, isn’t it funny how a public place with dozens of customers can be less distracting than our own living room couch!

This is an interesting statement – “When I expressed to a friend not too long ago that I was reading Jonathan Edwards’ treatise On the Religious Affections (yes, I’m still plodding through), he quipped, “So are you unsaved yet?”There are a handful of places in this treatise that are the most discomforting, but difficult to apply. I was listening the other day to Vance’s narration of this book and was really being edified and crying out “amen.” Then he began the 12th positive sign, “XII. Gracious and holy affections have their exercise and fruit in Christian practice.”It is the “sins of omission” details that unsaint us. We all feel weighed in the balance and wanting. If anyone has the edition with the footnotes, the sermon quoted from Solomon Stoddard can really un-nerve you. (Way to Know Sincerity and Hypocrisy).But we should take comfort in the fact that the best of men were searched by this treatise and came out the better for it. I am studying the life of Asahel Nettleton for an upcoming Sunday School. He went through a time of serious introspection with this book in hand, as well as Edward Payson. But though both men had doubts, they were both very godly Christian pastors from the beginning of the 19th century.If there is a single sermon that is the most helpful to assist to analyze if the root of the matter is in us it is his sermon, “Hypocrites Deficient in the Duty of Prayer.” The description of the effects of the new birth by Edwards are so accurate and helpful. A regenerated person is a praying person.

I’ve never heard of Freddy, but I love good recommendations like this. I’ll have to seek out his adventures. Thanks!

Sounds like fun; and Florida needs the rain! 😉 Sorry we had to miss it; maybe next year?But we saw a fireworks spectacular that evening; yes, my hometown does their show on the 3rd every year. The population doubles that evening – to a whopping 10,000!–ae

Ahh- 30 years ago, I was in piercing pain from an abscess in my gum, and still managed to sing at your wedding in an upright position…Have a wonderful time in Chicago, and if you need “insider” tips, call me for my brother Matt’s cell number– they live near the Loop!Love,Chris

Coming through loud and clear.Hope you had a wonderful time in Chicago!Chris

That is a great picture of you and Barb! chicago is a neat city with lots to see and do. Another fantastic pizza place is The Silo in Lake Bluff near Libertyville. It’s at least 30 years since we’ve been to the Silo, but it’s still a popular dining spot. G

Hi. I’m a friend of John and Xande’s in Chicago. Just had to say that I found this book fascinating and am looking forward to others by Larson. He has one on called Lethal Passage about guns in the US that looked interesting, but I am sure anything by him would be gripping.

Yikes.When I was in 2nd grade, my mom taught college English classes and sometimes brought me along with her. While I still do make grammatical mistakes (not just typos!), I do tend to reflexively cringe when I see and hear grammar errors. Blame it on my mom. *eg*

Amen!

Hmmm. What are you ‘Amening’ to? Oh, I know… that rotten apple comment! Yup, you know me well.

OOPS! there you go: a typo – I promise – in monotheism. Talk about fallibility!–ae

And this made me think of the way our experience actually tells us that the ancients (medievals) had it right: a classical Christian education in the humanities broadly is really the best preparation for life. St. John’s is one take on that classical model.:-)

I watched the “last lecture” several months ago. it was excellent, really. I also wonder, have I lived well? Have I chosen the best things to do with my time, that will prepare me for eternity? Have I really enjoyed God and His creation and gifts to me? I’m afraid this is yet another area where I am left wanting, and a debtor to grace alone…

Great post. I immediately thought of Derek Webb’s song, “A New Law”:Don’t teach me about politics and governmentJust tell me who to vote for Don’t teach me about truth and beautyJust label my musicDon’t teach me how to live like a free manJust give me a new lawI don’t wanna know if the answers aren’t easySo just bring it down from the mountain to meI want a new lawDon’t teach me about moderation and libertyI prefer a shot of grape juiceDon’t teach me about loving my enemiesDon’t teach me how to listen to the SpiritJust give me a new lawWhat’s the use in trading a law you can never keepFor one you can that cannot get you anythingDo not be afraid

You shouldn’t expect many comments on this post. We are two of your four or so readers and we don’t use such new-fangled technology. Maybe the other two don’t either. I’m just sayin’.–ae

Randy,Maybe I need to get out there more often. The Administration building can be a bit lonely…

I have no clue who these people are, but I love their story. Being a single person in a society where marriages are constantly falling apart, their story gives me hope as well as a warning. Thanks for posting it.Tom

Free WiFi at church on sundays. 🙂

Unfortunately, you have to work your entire medical career to go and pay off your med school loans (or at least half of it), so it will have to take a committment from the training end of the medical community if they want to send doctors. They would have to give an education for free, and those that want to give away free medical care aren’t always the kind of students that end up getting the free tuition…(at least as I’ve always understood it…)…

Amen. Why let others steal all the good words?!

Rebekah, I know your heart. But I must say that the tendency to desire worship that ‘feels good’ is not the exclusive provence of the Dutchman (I’ve never seen one change…) or the Scot or the white man. Just as we do not see many white evangelicals sacrificing to worship across racial lines, nor do we see many black evangelicals making a similar sacrifice to worship in white churches. My only point is that try as we might to speak objectively about worship, we are still always drawn to what is comfortable, and we need to take that into account when we debate worship. But that is true of every person, not just the white presbyterian. Don’t you agree?

I do agree. But you don’t have any Black readers (that I know of)–Reformed and Dutch are the ones more likely to grace your pages. I speak of people that are in your and my scope of relationships because it’s so close to home. (As is the concept of multiracial church because there are a lot of African Americans in my scope of relationships.) We see our Reformed churches splintering into tinier and tinier sects because of this comfort factor, but having not been to any other churches lately, this is what comes to mind.God hasn’t called us to be comfortable, He calls us to do what’s right, and like you (sort of) said in your response to my comment, we ought to take that into account in deciding who we should worship with.

R, you are certainly right. I don’t imagine many reading this are African American. I don’t even think my kids read this! And, honestly, I’ve been a bit cast out of the traditional Dutch community, and my honorary wooden shoes were long ago revoked. So, I’m not sure how many of a Dutch persuasion read. But, I don’t know that, really. Regardless, I have been successful when we realize that the arguments we make about aesthetics or order or music or whatever in worship are going to be heavily tinged with the cultural bias we bring to the table. That’s all. And, Fiona, to some that sounds like I’m speaking a foreign tongue! And MagistraCarminae (aka Chris, no doubt a fugitive from the law seeking to hide her real identity…) says what I think is an important thing to note, though I’m not sure it can completely be avoided… that we find more thrill in the emotions than we do in Christ. So, we plod along, and Jesus still accepts our praises. That is a wonder! Thanks for all the comments – keep them coming. I love the interaction.

Uh-oh, did I sound arrogant? I hope not. 🙁 Although, if I did, I’m sure someone will ‘kick my derierre’…(preferably with a slipper!)fm

And this is why I don’t label myself “Right-Wing Conservative” anymore… It doesn’t make any sense to not regulate things that let us breathe freely!

Woohoo! Congratulations!

Doing a happy dance for you, J! Congrats!

The first may be more for women: http://rocksinmydryer.typepad.com/shannon/She is a PCA woman who writes (often humorously) about family etc, and each Wednesday hosts “Works for me Wednesday.” This is where readers can share helpful hints on a plethora of subjects. For anyone who cooks, allrecipes.com is a helpful site. You can find dozens of recipes based on what ingredients you want to include.Personally, I find google to have a wealth of information on any number of topics. It sometimes relates closely to the aforementioned recipe site because one can learn how to purchase, ripen, store, prepare – for example – unfamiliar fruits/vegetables.–ae

Like snowbot, I find monergism.org to be a great clearinghouse for Reformed resources. Though, like any place online, read with discernment — I’ve come across a few links that had me raising an eyebrow. (Oh–off topic–the bookstore at monergism.com is having a sale on Berkhof’s Systematic Theology. Only $20!)Even though my daily drive isn’t that long, I do have time in the car without the kids to talk to and I like to listen to the mp3 player while I drive. I’ve become quite a fan of podcast lectures and sermons. Covenant Theological Seminary has the courses of their core program online for free download at Covenant Worldwide. “Humanity, Christ and Redemption” is my favorite course so far — truly thought- and worship-provoking.UC Berkeley also offers a large number of courses available as podcasts for free download. Yes, THAT Berkeley. Listen with discretion. Still, they offer some very interesting lectures.For mom encouragement, I like the ThatMom Podcast. She’s down-to-earth, has both grown kids and kids at home. It helps that I’m friends with her daughter and like their family a lot!The local library websites (Sarasota, Manatee) are great to reserve and renew books. And I’m a sucker for Google Maps. Love looking at the satellite view of the house my Dad is building, the building where we lived in Ukraine and planning trips.

One place I find refreshing and insightful is st anne’s public house. They have talks and interviews that are always relevant to the Christian life. Check out their archives in the cellar. Here’s a link.http://www.stannespublichouse.com/home/Tom

This is something I struggle with, primarily because many of the things that I love to do come with relative ease. If it is easy in the beginning, it is hard to push through to a high level of competence. As a linguist friend told me once: I can get a B with no work and it takes a ton of work to get an A, so I’ll take the B. It has been hard for me to shake that attitude.

I read the book some time ago. I loved it because it made me learn American history I didn’t know or had forgotten. I also was vaguely aware of the televised series and was intrigued. Now I’m hoping the set is in your “lending library for friends.” (Maybe in exchange for dinner/games, even retroactive?) :)–ae

ae – we rented the DVDs from Blockbuster Online, so we can’t put them in your hands. But I suspect the library or any local Blockbuster will have them.Staci – by all means, put this book on the 1000 books to read before you die!Randy

And the first part of the above post, apparently lost in cyber space, was, “I am praying for you all here, Randy!”

Fay fizzled. But our family still gets an unexpected day “off.” *grin*

I’m excited about the new site. Glad to help!

In May, I read Mr. McCullough’s Commencement Address to Boston University. It was an outstanding speech. Do an internet search for the actual text of the speech and you will find, that in fact, it truly does look as if the speech was typed on a typewriter and not a computer. He likely avoided the hypothetical problem of children spilling water on his computer keyboard. But I digress. Here are some of my favorite lines from that commencement address. “Make the love of learning central to your life. What a difference it can mean. If your experience is anything like mine, the books that will mean the most to you, books that will change your life, are still to come. And remember, as someone said, even the oldest book is brand new for the reader who opens it for the first time. You have had the great privilege of attending one of the finest colleges in the nation, where dedication to classical learning and to the arts and sciences has long been manifest. If what you have learned here makes you want to learn more, well that’s the point. Read. Read, read! Read the classics of American literature that you’ve never opened. Read your country’s history. How can we profess to love our country and take no interest in its history? Read into the history of Greece and Rome. Read about the great turning points in the history ofscience and medicine and ideas. Read for pleasure, to be sure. I adore a good thriller or a first-rate murder mystery. But take seriously –read closely –books that have stood the test of time. Study a masterpiece, take it apart, study its architecture, its vocabulary, its intent. Underline, make notes in the margins, and after a few years, go back and read it again. Make use ofthe public libraries. Start your own personal library and see it grow. Talk about the books you’re reading. Ask others what they’re reading. You’ll learn a lot. And please, please, do what you can to cure the verbal virus that seems increasingly rampant among your generation. I’m talking about the relentless, wearisome use of the words, “like,” and “you know,” and “awesome,” and “actually.” Listen to yourselves as you speak. Just imagine if in his inaugural address John F. Kennedy had said, “Ask not what your country can, you know, do for you, but what you can, like, do for your country actually.” “Thanks for the discussion.Staci

DI – if you have not read Stephen King’s On Writing, you should, if you like reading about how writers write. A fascinating insight and, of course, well written.

Keeping an online notebook. . . yes, that’s a good way to describe what blogs can be.It’s like a tool for a modern day Jonathan Edwards. Instead of having paper pinned to our coats, and writing while riding a horse, we have our computer screens at the ready as we go about our daily tasks.

“…why do such things…need to be said at all?” I can’t adequately answer that question, but if statistics are to be believed, these are indeed startling:1/3 of high school graduates never read another book for the rest of their lives.42 percent of college graduates never read another book after college.80 percent of U.S. families did not buy or read a book last year.70 percent of U.S. adults have not been in a bookstore in the last five years. Source; publishing guru Dan Poynter, via http://www.humorwriters.org/startling stats./html (University of Dayton)It’s inexplicable. I cannot imagine such a life. I’m with Thomas Jefferson who said, “I cannot live without books.” And with Babington Macaulay who is quoted thus: “I would rather be a poor man in a garret with plenty of books than a king who did not love reading.”–ae

MG, a man after my own heart. Typed this comment after returning to his new house from a visit to the local library, thrilled to find that it was only a block or two away. Statistics can be very fluid things, and can be used greatly to obscure the truth. However, Math not being MG’s strong suit, it is possible, it seems to me, if 1/3 never read again, that leaves 2/3 who do, and out of that 2/3 might come the 1/2 who attend college. Of course, then, if you add the 1/2 of college graduates and the 1/3 of high school grads who never read another book, you would have about 50% of the world never reading another book.We could go on all day and night. But my question becomes, is there something in our education that kills the desire to read? Or is there a reading gene that naturally predisposes us to read? Or whatever.

Thanks for taking the time to say something, Chris. I have a BS in English Education from MSU, a degree for which I never once had to read a line of Shakespeare. I hope that had the ‘education’ part of the major been dropped that I might have been required to read something of substance. But still…

I love the poem, especially as one who grew up in a home with no tv and a family of readers. The readers continue in the younger generations.I’m still mulling over whether it’s “nature or nurture”; I think I am ready to conclude it’s a combination of the two. One thing is certain: if it’s nature (a “reading gene”), then your reading youngster did not inherit it from you and Barb. That furthers my thought that nurture has a huge influence.–ae

Nurture no doubt has an influence. I think that’s been proven. And what are you saying, ae, about my children not inheriting our genes? :-)And, Geoff, I apologize for the O-L reference. I hope the trauma does not disable you completely. I post the encouragement to read, knowing how weak I am myself. But, for my nighttime reading, just finished a long project and picked up, finally, Moneyball, finally. Fascinating.The wife and I tried for years to NOT own, and then not to BUY a television. But I grew up with TV on all the time. I think that is why I’ve grown to have such a love/hate relationship with the thing. I’d rather read a book. However, one can’t watch the Rays play ball in a book!

We used to take half-day trips to the library, and then the other half-day we got to skip our regularly scheduled lessons to read what we’d brought back. 🙂 We always, always were read to, and the stories were read with magnificent melodroma. I loved books so much I suppose because of the interesting places and people I travelled to and was introduced to. My interest in reading has diminished, probably because I’ve gotten lazy, and probably because I got tired of having to read so much in college.

That ought to worry you! The world is falling under the spell of Hollywood. The end is coming! The sky is falling! Actually, how can you go wrong with these three movies? Each so well done in its own right.Next up to post comments on: Into the Wild, reference to which might find its way into the comments I will make at an upcoming wedding at which I will be officiating…. Doom is on the horizon.

Yes, of course. All great martyrs have had the air of fanaticism about them, haven’t they?

Funny. Very, very funny.Staci

Amazing, amazing article about your neighbor Paul’s skills on and off the court.

Amen! God is definitely in the details of our lives!

🙂

*LOL, Gail*(btw, missed you today. . .)

Oops… Snowbot didn’t say that. I did. Keith used my computer for his film class, and was logged in to his email account. Relax, Keith… I didn’t read any of your gmail messages!

If you open the picture in its own window, you can see that the file name is “s_beets_CIG.”Could the crop be beets?

Okay, now that I’ve read elsa’s comment I’m changin’ my guess to sugar beets – based on the relationship of you and your “sugar beet” gal. =)–ae

I think the logic transfers over directly. Jesus told his disciples to pray to the Lord of the harvest that He would bring forth workers for the harvest. Jesus is reminding us that it is God who calls and equips workers in the harvest of souls. In the same biblical book in which Jesus makes that statement it is also records Jesus teaching, training, testing, correcting and rebuking his disciples. Yes, God is the one who calls and equips but we are responsible for our God given role to tend the crop following the example of Jesus.Good post Randy!Scott Ellison

I was going to say tobacco….Just as farming is a blend of common and special grace, so is church growth…

Woo Hoo! Have a great time!

Hey, that magic number is 1!

Oooooooooohhhhhhhhh! Nothing is ever as it seems. Such a complicated juggling of stats and figures. G

Feeling welcome, loved, accepted, at home in a church is certainly important. A young woman told me today she felt all those things when walking into the church fellowship for the first time. That is a good thing, what we’d like our church culture to be like. We, A., J, and I, discussed the need to encourage one another in our walk with the Lord and so we thanked God for the gift of relationships. But personally, can I be myself entirely? No. We’re not there yet, but with God’s grace we will be some day.G

This is why I hate presidential election races. Nobody fights fair. It is always a spin game where you make yourself look good by implying that the other guy (or gal) is one step away from being the spawn of Satan. Blatant disrespect for the office of the President is rampant these days, but how can we expect the American people to respect their leaders when they do everything they can to disrespect each other?

I to was hoping that the ads this season could focus on what Candidate X stands for and less how many lollypops Candidate Y has stolen from small children.

He’s amazing!

Should have heard it live. Quite impressive.

What is missing in that list is one of Hope’s great strengths — Christ-focused preaching and grace-centered teaching.

Now and then one should be allowed a diversion, don’t you think?Yes, it has been fun.

Yes, kind of destroys the atmosphere. I actually work on this during ‘family night’ while Colin, Isaiah, and 392 other kids under that age of ten bounce around. Sometimes there is a clown there playing “Old MacDonald” on a cassette tape full volume so the deaf children (I suppose) can hear the song. I like your picture better. But where’s my pipe? Wouldn’t I need a pipe? 🙂

I’m with you, but if we go this far, I definitely am going to have to ditch the laptop, perhaps for a yellow legal pad. That will make posting a bit more complicated, to be sure, but the laptop clashes with the rest of the scene. And with the fireplace, I believe I’m going to need some cooler weather. So, we may have to part with Florida.And please, make it a cup of tea. I’m not prudish, but I’m not sure scotch and I will agree. And one thing further: no cats. Do not suggest a cat curled up at the foot of the chair. I don’t like cats. (Which is odd, since fully erect bi-pedal cows don’t seem to bother me.)

Excellent quote, Randy. I think in my younger days I was tempted to remove all mystery from our beliefs, but much mystery remains and is at the heart, isn’t it? It’s all about God being God and us, well, not being God.Chris

This is my favorite part of “Paris, je t’aime”, and I think teaches a very good lesson about loving people. It actually teaches a good lesson about sanctification, if you think about it….we grow into the role God created us to play as we act it out. That might be a jump, but the lecture from my seminary class this morning is still in my head….

Nah, laptops don’t class with the scene, as long as you are using a Mac. Right?And you can get a pipe from S. E. Thile, one that would really fit the image.

Absolutely right. The MacBook will blend in well with the rest. And the pipe would be purely cosmetic. Smoking has never been my way of calming frazzled nerves. For that M&Ms are my drug of choice, I'm afraid.

Three is my choice with two as a close, close 2nd. Both are readable, pleasing to the eye, warm, coffee and cream-like. :-)Gail

It does have a happy ending, I think! It’s not only a great lesson in interpersonal relationships for marriage, it’s a good lesson for interpersonal relationships in general (I took it for the class “Interpersonal Relationships.”)

I, being steeped in the International Style, am partial to #4. I like the cleanness and the font. However, since I read the blog via Mail, I rarely have/get to see it, unless I post. So take my opinion (keep in mind it is an aesthetically trained opinion 🙂 ) for what it is.

I haven’t seen any blogs with 4, so that might be a good reason to go with that one, along with the attractive font.

Randy,Wow, what a powerful picture of love. Sometimes we do have to take steps (behavioral) and the emotional will come later. Same thing goes sometimes with personal disciplines.

Thank you, Randy. I (Chris)read these quotes with tears to Dave this morning, until I could not read them, and Dave had to finish. This drives me to my knees at the thought of my own poverty in the things of God. Thank you for these reminders.Chris and Dave, in CO for the weekend

Hey, I don’t know who you are Mr/Ms Anonymous Person, but thanks for the info!

Randy,Thanks for reminding us of this timeless truth. Happiness is not real unless shared. I almost called you last night, but instead just shared the moment with Amy!

Randy,Thanks for reminder to look at church history. It is a perfect complement to my nostalgia thoughts. I love history, so church history to me is entertaining to read. But it is also devotional to see how God sustains His church. And it is also challenging how His saints have responded to His call over the years. And finally, it is practical, allowing us not repeat mistakes. Nothing new under the sun.

Hey Randy-Are you in mourning today?;-)Chris

It took me a while, but I emerged from my funk – aided by a fishing trip, of course, that that hope springing eternal stuff. So, yes, from the depths of somber dullness, let’s shoot for 8-2.

That is precisely what it is. Thanks for the compliment.

Dramamine not needed. Really. The Gulf, even a mile or two out – whatever we were – was nearly as calm as a pond. It was amazing. Calm, not too hot, beautiful blue sky. Really, God was gracious. This was, of course, a day designed to bless Colin, not me, but it worked on us both.

But you won the lottery? That’s at least better than us–not any of our names were picked!

Woohoo! Congrats on the Ray’s win! Besides, great pitching last night, seeing the Rays win on their home turf, made this victory–even sweeter! A Blue Jays Fan

What made it even sweeter was that it silenced the cocky arrogance of the Red Sox fans. I don’t think I would have minded if they’d lost to Toronto…

Phew! All I can say is, Game 7 and the Rays win was a lot of stress. My head was pounding, and not from the deafening noise. But, how cool it was to be be able to attend in person and see the Rays come up with a Championship. No hockey game is that stress-filled, even during the Stanley cup!(Go Lightning!) Maybe we’ll win next drawing, but here’s hoping the Rays win it in 4. Go Rays!

Rebekah, I’m passing over the dullness this year for a bit more passion. *wink*

Not yet…– The G’s

FAN-tastic! True blue fans sportin’ the Rayhawks. G

Yes, Randy, I do think that we are too comfortably ignorant on difficult issues, both as a nation and as a Christian community. My mother has been a fabulous model for me in this regard. She did not attend college but instead worked to pay for my father’s undergraduate and graduate education. She had two children in the 70’s and stayed home with us when all of the other women in her circles were going back to work to do something “important”. I watched her on a daily basis become educated as an “uneducated women” on difficult issues for her. For example, she grew up in a non-sports loving home. My father and little brother love sports, football especially, and so she learned the game. Why? Because she realized that she was missing out on something wonderful? No. She learned the game because she knew it would deepen her relationship with her son. Today, their relationship goes way deeper than football, but I know that becoming fluent in the pigskin language gave her inroads to that deeper relationship. My dad worked his entire career in the nuclear power industry. Again, my mom learned the language and the theories and the problems and positives and could discuss her husband’s line of work almost as well as he could. What a beautiful gift it was to listen to their dinner table conversations!In the same way, I have found that becoming less ignorant on the topics of the day can deepen my conversations with my non-believing friends. As I’m able to talk the language of the topics that are important to them, the the conversations deepen, and they eventually go to discussions that can be directed toward God and Christ. Knowing political platforms of both parties has enabled me to have great discussions with several non-believing friends that have lead to conversations on morality and then God. Learning a little about the independent, punk rock music industry, while certainly not my favorite topic, has enabled me to have conversations with my CEO-of-a-record-label friend that lets her know I care about what she does (even though I hate that kind of music). That care has opened roads to conversations about the meaning of life and Christ and the Bible. When my husband was a relatively new believer, our pastor went to the wastewater treatment plan where John worked to try and understand his career path a little, even though said pastor could have cared less about a sewage plant. John still talks about the impact that had on him.So, while I do think we have a responsibility as humans to get rid of our ignorance on uncomfortable topics, we have an even greater responsibility as Christians to know about the things that are important to the people to whom God has providentially placed in our paths.What do we do about it? Three things: stretch ourselves, listen and read. Then read again and again. Read while at the stop lights. Read while waiting at the doctor’s office. Read while watching the World Series!Great topic! Thanks for bringing it up.Staci

I thought you were joking! I WAS joking! I feel like such a wimp. Now I REALLY have to go buy a shirt….Staci

Good thoughts on the Hawk. We had one trying to come through our glass window on three separate occasions. Not sure what he wanted, but man those things are cool.In the new heavens and earth, a better question to ask is this: will snook eat mullet or other bait fish? I sure hope so, because it is so cool to watch them get popped on top! But for sure, stupid porpoises won’t eat snook. But will we? Will we be hitting up vegetables more often? Will we be vegans?

If you are looking for a good fantasy series, I think that The Chronicles of Prydain by Lloyd Alexander is a good choice. It has been some time since I read them, but they were written for children, so I don’t think that they are as intense as LOTR. The main character is Taran, a boy who longs to be a hero. Eventually, through a recognition of his own inadequacy, he succeeds. They are loosely base on Welsh Mythology says the infallible font of all knowledge, Wikipedia. I remember reading them all several times and enjoying them immensely, though I may have been older than 6 and 9. A catholic blog I found has an exaustive list of potentially “Objectionable” material, but they also list a boy befriending a girl and trying to protect her and “A girl kisses a dwarf on the head” as “Adult Content”. All this to say that I loved them, and I think that others will also.

Hey, Mr. Geoffsnook, you are supposed to have the answers, being a pastor and all….

For sure, this called for caffeine in my 16 oz. coffee mug! I had to jerk myself up by the collar and remind myself, ‘so the Rays lost last night. Get a grip,girl! It’s only a game!’ Gail

I think we need to read good theology, good fiction, and a good selection of things that come from a perspective different from our own. We need to read for pleasure, read for current events information, and read for depth of understanding. I try to make myself read worthy books, and reward myself with fluff, but avoid a steady diet of fluff. I like World Magazine, blogs, the Intercollegiate Review, and lots of books.

Coming late to this. . .There is so much brilliant children’s literature, that I like to be careful to read as much literature aimed at younger children in the younger years as I can. It seems older children lose the taste for “younger” books, and only rediscover how wonderful they are when they are adults.One of our favorite read-alouds, while not fantasy, is an adventure story — Helen Taylor’s adaption of the classic, “Little Pilgrim’s Progress.”I’ve also read The Hobbit aloud to the boys. I agree with MC that they can be intense. In principal, I’d probably wait until the children were a little older to read it — but we really liked it a lot and my boys were pretty young when I read it to them!Another not-quite-fantasy book that we’ve enjoyed is D’Aulaire’s Book of Greek Myths, which the boys call the Hilarious Book of Greek Myths. (D’Aulaire’s can sound like Hilarious when you’re just a kid!) I respect that some families prefer to wait until their children are much older to introduce this sort of mythology, but we found it a good foil for talking about what we DO believe and why people believe otherwise.Hubby introduced me to The Chronicles of Prydain. His mom read them aloud to him. (For locals. . . The Goodwill Bookstore tends to have these in stock regularly.)I have the unpleasant affliction of falling asleep when I’m reading aloud in the evening, so we haven’t done much of it lately. But we did listen to the Brian Jacques books on tape together a year ago or so. The boys loved them. I heard about the series first from Jerram Barrs — and have a copy of his booklist for children posted here.

Several people close to me (not at church, but elsewhere) have basically taken the abortion issue off of the table this election season with the comment, “Nothing has changed the past 8 years in protecting the unborn.”And I can understand that sentiment. But then. . . one of the first things the current president did was to reverse the executive orders of the previous president regarding federal funding for abortion. The past two Supreme Court nominees have been ones that tend towards stricter construction of the Constitution (as opposed to the tendency of activist judges of the Warren court.) And one of the current candidates has stated that one of his first acts as president would be to promote and sign the Freedom of Choice Act, which would go beyond Roe v. Wade.It seems as if our culture as a whole HAS been shifting towards what the pro-life movement has advocated — a place where abortion is unnecessary and unthinkable, a place where the choice for life is doable, where the community support structures are in place, where shame doesn’t require hiding pregnancy. And this is a good thing. . . But it’s still tenuous and FOCA and federal funding would not help. . .So, I simply can’t put this one issue aside. . .

Indeed I’ve considered it. But I’d appreciate it if you, or Mr. Adams, would persuade me that such a vote is NOT lost.

FYI, I’m still undecided. But for what it’s worth, I just ran across this article from Constitution Party candidate Chuck Baldwin.. it’s his attempt to persuade you that a vote for him is not a wasted vote.

Many of you know I am rabidly pro-life having risked arrest and gone to jail to save the unborn. I still am a radical when it comes to the unborn, but I’ve softened in the last year or two when it comes to being a “one-issue voter,” a term I despised being labeled with. My vote is already cast and so……we await the outcome for good or ill. G

Despite my tendency to get jumpy, and excitable on this topic, I am really very rational…I only get disturbed when people don’t go through the complex decision matrix that you, Randy obviously went through. (I’m not pointing any fingers at any of the readers of this blog–just at strict partisan voting in general). As tulipgirl points out, some gains were made during the past 8 years to fight the pervasiveness of abortion, but what made me take it off the table, so to speak, is that I think abortion is fixed in the American mindset as a given right. It’s not going to be outlawed, and I think there are enough checks and balances in place from solid conservative leaders and watchdog groups that it’s not going to become much more pervasive. And within your own personal sphere, you can do life-affirming things. (And I didn’t say that because I think tulipgirl is wrong–that was just more…a reflection upon my personal thought process). Somebody asked me the other day how I as a “good little Christian” could be supporting the ticket I was heading out to campaign for, and I said, “Well, the only thing I support the other ticket on is their view of abortion and gay marriage,” then consequently left off the important rest of the answer about how as a “good little Christian,” I support the ways the ticket values life in other ways… So, I guess I’m saying that I think…you could be sinning to vote for either candidate…or you could be honoring God…by voting for either candidate. It all depends upon your heart orientation as you bubble in your ballot.

Re: ‘abortion right’It will be interesting to find out if the South Dakota constitutional initiative to ban abortions passes.g

A quick note on Chuck Baldwin, this guy is one of those special people that I can’t have a rational discussion about. This man is a conspiracy theory nut, a loony, and a crackpot. Coming from me, who believes in Big Foot and that Marilyn Monroe was murdered is saying volumes. He continues to ignore every piece of evidence to the contrary and perpetuate the lie of a North American Union and that the Security and Prosperity Partnership of North America will end life as we know it goto the web page and read about it Chuck http://www.spp.gov/. There will be NO Amerodoller. “They” are not going to merge Mexico, Canada, and the US. There are no secret plots to dissolve our national sovereignty. There are no planes for a NAFTA Super Highway running from Canada to Mexico. What’s worse is he knows this is true but he uses it to get attention to his pathetic political campaign. A man according to his own article wants to release immediately two boarder patrol agents who shot a man and then tried to cover it up. Disgusting.

If we had the cash Alissa wanted to dress up as Mulder and Scully. Left to her own devices she would no doubt dress up as a ray of sunshine or a flower, or something else full of happiness.

Halloween has its roots in the ancient Celtic festival known as Samhain, a celebration of the end of the harvest season. Later cultures believed that departed spirits came back to inhabit the bodies of those left behind. To scare them away they began decorating turnips, potatoes with scary faces. Various Popes moved All Saints Day from May 13 to October, perhaps to counteract the pagan festival. You’ll find more than you cared to know by doing a Google or Wikipedia search.G

Randy,I could go dressed up as the home plate umpire for Game 5. That dude was every bit as scary as a witch, and without the predictability…Geoff

“. . .what made me take it off the table, so to speak, is that I think abortion is fixed in the American mindset as a given right. It’s not going to be outlawed. . .”More or less, I see things in a similar way. I still think great strides can be made to continue to make abortion undesirable, unnecessary, unthinkable. . . Most of that will continue to be through cultural shifts. Maybe it’s just my perspective, but while “abortion rights” seem to be more of a given among GenX/GenY — doesn’t it seem to you that these same groups are more pro-life than what we saw 10-15 years ago?And while I believe this is primarily a cultural shift and that it is highly unlikely that abortion will be “outlawed,” in the near future, there are still government actions (judicially, legislatively, administratively) that can either hurt or help vulnerable pregnant women, their children and families. Funding for Planned Parenthood here in the states and around the world, judicial appointments, enforcing health standards for freestanding abortion clinics, Women’s Right to Know acts. . . so many things that either promote abortion as the “solution” or promote true solutions. But, I’m preaching to the choir here. . . *grin*

Oh! I forgot to write also. . .”And while I believe this is primarily a cultural shift and that it is highly unlikely that abortion will be “outlawed,” in the near future. . .”I’m not ready to give up hope that protection of the preborn, the aged, the infirm and the vulnerable is beyond good and life-affirming legislation. The boys and I watched “Amazing Grace” a few weeks ago during Mommy Movie Night. What an amazing example of perseverance, going against what the culture had accepted as the norm, continuing to shine the light on the darkness of slavery. . . I have a friend who has said she is cynical, and if Roe is reversed and legislation on abortion goes back to the states, the result would be people pridefully saying, “Not in my state. . .” while turning a blind eye to the problems around them.On the contrary, I believe that after the dust and legislation pretty much settled in various states, I think we’d see people’s efforts expand. . . continuing to care for mothers and children. . . but also to other communities in need. Maybe I’m optimistic. . . maybe I’m naive. . . But I am hopeful.

“I’d be interested in hearing from Rebekah, though, what life-affirming things Christians can be doing beyond supporting (or not supporting) pro-life candidates. That’s not a challenge – I’m sincerely interested.”I’m not Rebekah, but I’d like to weigh in on this a little. A life-affirming thing that Christians can do is to encourage their loved ones/friends with infertility problems to consider adoption as a first choice instead of a second choice after significant infertility treatments have been attempted. All too often, infertile couples are uneducated in the moral issues that surround things like in vitro, as they are desperate to have children. Christians tend to be hesitant to discuss the moral dilemas surrounding such significant fertility treatments because educated discussions can lead to the abortion realm. Encouraging, urging, suggesting adoption to people struggling with infertility is a wonderful, life-affirming thing that Christians can do to help the pro-life agenda. That, in my opinion and experience, would be a very good place to start.Staci

I’m not sure what exactly to say–I said we can do “life affirming things,” but what are they? I don’t know… I agree with Staci that encouraging couples to adopt, instead of venturing into what I say is the morally “biguous” realm of in vitro, is a huge one. (I actually had somebody tell me that he supports abortion because people aren’t willing to adopt the kids that are already out there and need parents). As a culture supporting families that choose to have lots of kids and not denigrating them (Hope hasn’t ever been a church like that, but culturally, big families are smirked at). And then at we get so worked up at Planned Parenthood–and rightly so, because their sex ed IS awful–but I’d love to see the “Christian Community” come up with a sex ed curriculum that can take over and be a really good, solid alternative to what Planned Parenthood is offering. That’s a whole other discussion that I could blog about all day long, but there’s a whole different mindset at play that views abortion as just another form of birth control and a baby as a disruption to the convenient and happy life that was previously at play. But I’m still a pessimist, and I think that nothing will change. I think things at the youth level in sex ed programs would probably have the biggest impact.

Well, I’m just glad that Gail is keeping you honest. Way to go, Gail!Chris, off to get some ice cream…

Rebekah – thanks for your thoughts. As to this: “I’d love to see the “Christian Community” come up with a sex ed curriculum that can take over and be a really good, solid alternative to what Planned Parenthood is offering. “I believe that CareNet has produced and has used locally an alternative. I’m not familiar with the details, but I know it is there and I suspect it is quality.

Thanks for the recommendation. Actually Jeremy had recommended that to me (twice) and I kept forgetting the name. Now it is safely tucked away in my Amazon.com wishlist, for any gift buyers out there…. Click here! (In case you didn’t know where to go… :-)Oh, I have no shame.

If I recall correctly, you came back from that trip seriously sunburned. So in that sense, the “Rays” won…

Great discussion! By the way, based on my previous comments, apparently I made the impression that I was arguing in favor of third parties. That wasn’t my intention! I posed the question for the sake of discussion. And the only reason I mentioned Chuck Baldwin was because Randy wanted to hear an argument in favor of third parties… so I directed him to his argument, since I had just read it. But I wasn’t intending to endorse him or even the idea of third parties, necessarily. Just clearing that up. Apparently there was some confusion on that matter. : )

Well, Matthew, sounds good to me. And gee, if I’m not mistaken, Christmas is just around the corner…So, what do you think of this guy’s assessment on Amazon.com: “Don’t bother to pick this up … McCarver has no business writing about something he doesn’t understand. There are much better ways to spend your hard earned cash!!”Did he read the same book?!

You may or may not like Tim McCarver and his broadcasting ability’s, but one thing he does know is baseball.

Randy-Great thoughts! You say:”To long for patience and self-control, among other things is good. This is to long for Christ-likeness. To long for the things of the Spirit, to lust, even, after the fruit of the Spirit (Galatians 5) is a good thing.”Isn’t part of the problem we have when we seek out the fruit without the Spirit? WHen we seek the outward manifestation, say, of self-control, as if it is available to us apart from Christ and His Spirit? Those tricky heart motivations are so important.You also say:”So, to walk according to the Spirit is to first know (by the law, even) where we are supposed to be, as painful as it is to realize that we are not yet there.”Amen and amen! As we are reading the Mortification of Sin in our Sunday School class, Owen makes this painfully real as he discusses the daily battle to die to self and live for Christ! What an excellent reminder for us. Can’t wait for next Friday’s thoughts…Chris

WOW! He’s cute, and the big fish is great. What an accomplishment.–ae

Come,now. Don’t you find the tiniest bit of humor in “Federal Express Express”? What’s next? Delta Airlines Flight Service? Avis Car Rental Car Rental? I don’t know what they SHOULD have called it – and that is a good question – but I think that what they CHOSE to call it is just funny.

This comment from Chris:”Isn’t part of the problem we have when we seek out the fruit without the Spirit?” has been so helpful to me as I’ve pondered this topic over the weekend. Sometimes it is helpful when someone puts words to your current struggle. Seeking fruit without the Spirit is what I so often do, but I wasn’t realizing I was doing it in that way until I read her comment.So, thanks again for the discussion, Randy. And thanks to Chris, who gave me one of those lightning bolt moments!Staci

Randy,I do walk away with profound movement in my soul from what you say, and I did when you spent a CONSIDERABLE amount of time answering my question many months ago. Chris is saying what you expressed in that Word document that you sent to me…she just said it in 16 words and it bit my soul when I read your thoughts that concisely! Oh, that more people would have a pastoral staff, like I do, that spend the time shepherding their flock like you and Geoff do. I am so thankful. And I’m thankful for people like Chris, who can bite my soul with words, having never met me!!!!!!Staci

I’m finding that a person’s eschatological view during this election season determines that person’s emotional state as he considers what happens if Candidate “A” wins over Candidate “B” or, “B” wins over “A.” Some years back we cried as our candidate lost. We despaired at the blackness that would ensue. Well, the world didn’t end. We forgot, for a time, that God carries out his plan regardless of which oval one bubbles in on the ballot, regardless of which candidate wins. Vote responsibly by carefully considering the issues at stake? Yes. Then rest in God to carry out his plan whatever the outcome. G

“Some years back we cried as our candidate lost. We despaired at the blackness that would ensue. Well, the world didn’t end.”Was that ’92? Because I remember feeling at the time that there was much reason to despair. . . and. . . like you said, well, the world didn’t end.

Yes, it was 1992. My first time to vote in a Presidential election was 1968. I listened to those returns at school in England. We all know what happened years later during that President’s 2nd term! G

Here are a few more links for snowbot:http://www.nrlchapters.org/obamabookhttp://www.obamawantsyou.com/http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NN4TKrViNE

Rejoicing in the good work accomplished by the Greenwalds that night. Barb is the woman!!Chris

I haven’t been able to listen to the song yet, but you definitely get brownie points in my book for knowing and liking OtR.

I thought certainly the candies used in your sermon illustration were leftover from the 31st. You mean you had to go out and buy MORE?!No one comes to our door, though there are some youngsters a few units away. We don’t stock up on candy b/c we don’t want it in the house.Spouse asks, “Why didn’t Randy borrow from son’s bag if he so much wanted treats?”–ae

greenbot.net would be a bit skimpy on selections. Remember, I ditched a lot of good music in a fit of holiness a couple decades ago.And as a pastor, I treasure brownie points however I get them. I seem quite adept at squandering them profusely over time!Glad to find some other OtR fans. Maybe someday they’ll actually come to Florida.

Alissa, you are my kind of girl… 😉

Well said. G

Not only did we vote – and it took less than 10 minutes with lines so short – we got our free Starbucks coffee afterward. What a country!The E’s

Amen and amen. You ought to get that woman to post her excellent thoughts more often!Love,Chris

Oh, yes, Chris. And I ought to jump out of an airplane. And run the Boston Marathon. And try for the land speed record at Bonneville. And run with the bulls in Pamplona. Yes, I ought to do this. ‘Tis a bit easier written than accomplished, experience has shown.

Well said, Barb! I was wondering when we would hear from you! You should comment more often. :)As the saying goes: “Quiet waters run deep!” Keep them coming Barb! Love ya!Fiona

There are times, of course, when it works the other way. My lips remain ‘stuck’ when I really should be saying something. Like, “Have you considered Christianity?”Wings, eh? Very curious.

The book is in the church library also.I’m glad to share “my” Gus with all y’all.–ae

My complements Barb, very well said! Especially the first sentence of the last par.: “I long for the day,when…..” If I just may add my optimistic view of this sentence:I believe that this day has arrived. I firmly believe that the majority of the voters did not vote for Mr.Obama because of his race, but voted for Mr.Obama because they believe he is the better candidate to lead our nation through this very difficult and turbulent times to a strong and healthy recovery.Paul Der

Echoing Chris. My first thought? Excellent.

Neat footnote! I’m thankful for tulip girl – her posts and her person and friendship.I have to add, though, that – being Dutch and a five point Calvinist and all – I consider myself a tulip girl too; but she got the name first!–ae

Venturing a guess, which was thought out before your footnote was added. 1) there is the element of liking to be scared: could I become a person like this, doing such awful things?2) an element of pride: I am better than that; I could/would never become such a person i.e. do such evil.FWIW–ae

I do not enjoy watching films portraying evil. It speaks of “man’s inhumanity to man” and scares me, I suppose, because these atrocities could easily be perpetrated on me. Interesting side note on the phrase I quoted:http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/244100.htmlThis phrase, which is always used with a sense of regret, was coined by Robert Burns and used in his poem From Man was made to Mourn: A Dirge, 1785: ‘Many and sharp the num’rous ills Inwoven with our frame! More pointed still we make ourselves Regret, remorse, and shame! And Man, whose heav’n-erected face The smiles of love adorn, – Man’s inhumanity to man Makes countless thousands mourn!Gail

I think this is true, Randy. But your questions was “Why do we enjoy watching evil”. There is a tough line for me to draw between enjoying evil as entertainment and seeing evil as a reminder of its potence and power in this broken world. I have no problem with being reminded. But I think I should have a problem with watching evil for entertainment. The problem is that line is so blurry for me. I think this is likely because I love evil too much, and don’t hate it enough.

I must admit that while I enjoy O’Connor to some degree, and understand her use of imagery and violence, it is not my cup of tea. And you are right in pointing out that we feel sympathy for the humanity of men in their tragic state. However, many things that one could argue avoid glorifying evil, give a more voyeuristic look at it than I am comfortable with. There are some things, after all, that should not even be named among us. Part of the question I struggle with is when I have crossed that line over into giving myself ideas I should be trying to avoid having. I don’t know if you understand what I’m saying. Speaking for myself, I can often find ways to justify watching evil that I probably shouldn’t, and give all kinds of great sounding arguments, just because on some level I want to. That is not a good reason to watch evil.

Amen, Randy. Perhaps the real question is, how do we watch film, or read books, or do anything for that matter, with an eye to the protection and growth of our own holiness through the process of becoming more Christ-like? I need to ask that question more often when I watch movies.

Hey Randy! Thanks for commenting on my post – it’s good to catch up with you and see your very active blog. You’re a dedicated blogger, and I like what I read. Blessings to you, Barb, and the family!

I’m sorry I didn’t have the pleasure of making your drink this time. Hopefully it was just as tasty! : )

Speaking of being OC sprayed.. I get to enjoy that little experience AGAIN tomorrow. I have seen and enjoyed both films. Why do violent sports, or video games appeal to so many? I think it runs along the same lines.

TG = Thanksgiving? I think I like that. *grin*

How I agree with Chris on the novel! But Too Late the Phalarope may be even better. I think “somber and dull” suits perfectly. ;)Not!–ae

Thanks for the comps on the picture, Chris. I shot about thirty pictures of that sun going down. More precious in the memory, though, was that the entire family was there enjoying the sunset. What a treasure that was.Too Late the Phalarope is good. Both books probe the regrets of fatherhood, and that is, well, somber. But not dull.And before I leave the subject, I thought JEJ was good in the movie version, but Richard Harris was remarkable. That said, the movie misses, in my mind, most of the redemptive themes. Still worth watching, however.

I’d heard of, but not read, Paton’s wonderful works. Picked up a copy at the Goodwill Bookstore yesterday, reminded by this post.

I think the Reverend Mr. Osborn is off base on this. The person who commented on his post makes a lot more sense. G

If one disagrees with someone is that considered being disrespectful?(Rhetorical question) I did not say I agreed with everything the commenter had written in response to Mr. Osborn’s post. Certainly I have no M.Div tacked onto the end of my name. G

Kathryn installed Linux on her computer quite a few years ago. G

The only thing that would be better is a photo of the twins and rolls, both freshly delivered! 🙂

How cool is that!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! G

Randy,I’ve heard more positive response about Hellboy II than I could have anticipated. It looks incredibly ridiculous, but now you’re like the billionth person to speak highly of it. I’m going to have to get Net Flix, since we can’t go to the dollar theater anymore.As far as Dan in Real Life-that was a fantastic picture of family. And it was super clean, as far as I remember.Pieces of April was also a quality flick. My favorite of course is Little Miss Sunshine. There is a beautiful picture of family finally coming together.Funny that movies can teach us stuff, eh? Guess that’s one more proof all of us are made in the Image of God.

Just for the record, I only said that I would WATCH Hellboy II. I’ve not yet commended it. I did find Hellboy I very interesting, and entertaining to boot. LMS certainly brings family together. Of course, you’ve got the whole ‘grandfather-teaching-the-granddaughter-the-stripper-moves’ thing going on, but beyond that, what a great movie. “This song is for my grandpa” “That’s nice. Where is your grandpa right now?” “In the trunk of our van.” And you have to love the suicidal Steve Carell responding to the final judgment at the end, “We can LIVE with that”!And what can you say about DiCapprio in Gilbert Grape? It was an amazing performance. I was not as thrilled with the movie as a whole, but its picture of the centrality of family, no matter the depth of our own individual weaknesses is marvelous. It suggests to me that though Hollywood does not affirm a Christian world view, it cannot help but to reveal a longing that is consistent with it.

I’ve only seen a handful of “Sopranos” episodes, and it’s a terrific show because the character interaction is rich and real feeling. But that brings it back to the problem of Tony the sociopath. Other than the obligatory mobster Catholic Church interactions in the episodes I saw, there wasn’t a lot of grace in Tony’s life and he didn’t pursue grace-filling opportunities–they were more grace-leeching than anything.Anyway, good post. It’s always helpful to have neutral TV characters that can point you into real life.

LOL! Brilliant!

I am not normally called ‘brilliant’ – so to have it happen TWICE in one day! Wow!And no matter how intrigued I would be to see a copy of the Gospel of Mr. S, I think I’ll pass on the bet. Not much surprises me anymore. I’d be sure to lose!

Amen, yet again, Randy. This has been such a practical and encouraging series!

As I recall, the cinematography was gorgeous, but we couldn’t wait for it to end. And LOL, Gail! We’ve had the same here…FWIW-Chris

Umm- make that Denmark.(Sheepishly backing away from my computer and hoping no on notices…)

Umm- I will definitely pass on the extended cut…

Do I detect a bit of defensiveness here? I no where suggested that a traditional white protestant service is boring, did I? No question that ALL cultures will bring something to the table. All cultures will have their tastes expanded, methinks.

Randy,I love the Thanksgiving Service. I think that is a great tradition we should continue having at Hope. Yes, it was a little taste of heaven on Earth. And since we have that taste in our mouths, we should do all that we can to keep tasting it by living our life with the goal of Jesus’ Kingdom moving forward (bringing heaven to earth). BTW-it is good for white people to clap, eh? As long as we can stay on rhythm.

Sorry you feel that way, Gail. I don’t know what might make you feel that. I think my only point was that there is and will be diversity, and that we ought to celebrate and enjoy that diversity whenever we can. These are our friends, and I am humbled that they would come worship with us, and bring their gifts as they did. I guess I’m just missing something. If there is anything that would cause one to look twice, as one would do at a sideshow, is that here were black and white worshiping together. So, as Geoff suggested, we need to continue to labor to bring that bit of heaven to greater expression on earth. Certainly there is nothing here with which you can disagree? Again, I apologize for not understanding your reaction!

Okay, that helps. Nothing meant to be condescending, for sure. I think I can say that for all the commenters. (Geoff was poking fun at those of us who are more uncomfortable with physical expression.) And though as people with limitations we will not always understand one another, that is no reason to remain quiet. I’m glad you spoke up.

Adri said we watched it a long time ago, but I can’t remember. It’s on order from library.gus

The whole rest of the wedding is forgotten except for “the tear on his cheek” Holy cow! I have feelings like the rest of humanity! Though my wife would question that from time to time.

Hey, I mentioned also the beautiful woman. I remember her…

I think the cinematography is stunning. The plot and script (and even the acting)are terrible. But the scenes of virgin woodlands, majestic shores, etc., are breath-takingly beautiful. The problem is that eventually you get underwhelmed by the rest of it. At least, that’s my opinion!

I suppose it could be worse. 🙂

Could be worse? Uh, I’m not sure. It makes ‘Randall Ray’ sound solidly lyrical….And about the song, Missy, I stumbled upon that accidentally while looking for another song. I’m excited.Yours, Topper

G&K, yup. . . they were originally from the New Braunfels area of Texas, just north of San Antonio. SA had a great little indie station that featured them on Saturday mornings. . . I have a. . . get this. . . a cassette from Sixpence from that era. (Sheesh. My kids hardly know what a cassette is!)

hooray! texting is soooo addictive. tulipgirl, instead of putting in a phone number, put in an email address–myname@email.com…

One of my happy memories is going out to my Dad’s car, and listening to his 8-track player in the car. . . Simon and Garfunkle.

Troglodytes that we are – and frugal, as you know – don’t expect any such from us, and don’t send any our way either!One of us can more easily remember some phone numbers and press the buttons quickly, rather than find the list, scroll down etc. The E’s

What an intriguing application of Edwards! As the mother of young men, even I must concur with your wisdom and experience regarding men. And (taking a bit of a rabbit trail) shouldn’t young people, who are considering lasting relationships, bring that other person around their family and their church body, and seek the advice of those wiser and more experienced than themselves? We have had a couple of experiences when women in our church started going with men whom I didn’t trust as far as I could spit them (and that wasn’t far!) In one case, the young woman listened to the advice of others, but in her desire to get married, she didn’t introduce her next beau, and then married him, and divorced him in a year. In the second case, the woman did not want opinions of anyone else, and married the man, and he left her within a year.I am not saying that fellowship and family can help us avoid every heart-break, but we ought to take serious advantage of the collective wisdom God has given us there! And it is the job of the young women (and men) to ask.

Ah, yes. Taking God’s good gifts and using them as weapons against one another…and unless I exercise a great deal of restraint, I will be off on another rabbit trail…

Very clever way to point out the most amazing aspect of sanctification: grace to huge that it covers all our sin!

“. . .godly young men are suspect for all the wrong reasons! Families and communities must not turn their wisdom into a weapon for micro-control.”Isn’t it sad? And ugly? Unfortunately, I’ve seen that. . .

Awww- and as I recall, Miss Black came to Loveland that Christmas, and you all came to an ICY Christmas retreat I was attending and Dave was chaperoning…or something like that…That seems like a million years ago in some ways, and like yesterday in others!Love you two!

*mush, mush*

Mush is okay, right? Or at 52 is mush indecorous? Uh, Chris, it WAS a million years ago. Shall we look in the mirror? 🙂

OT. . . you mentioned a recent study that was the source for some of your stats this morning. . . to which study were you referring? (*blush* Yes, I’m a demographics geek.)

Great post! He truly was our wonderful counselor. Reminds me of a writing from Spurgeon from 2 Samule 15:23. http://www.ccel.org/ccel/spurgeon/morneve.d0531am.htmlMerry Christmas!

The church that Alissa and I have been attending plays a wonderful mix of both hymns and contemporary music. It is really nice to hear the songs we grew up singing mixed with songs we love to sing everyday.p.s. What does this C.S. Lewis guy know anyway? He just wrote some silly children’s books. =)

Coming back to clarify. . . that wasn’t usually due to “music,” per se. . . but a general lack of focus in worship and the big personalities of people involved. . . Music or style or what-have-you was incidental. . .

Keith and I saw the movie last week.It’s a delightful movie, with dark scenes which I feared would scare the daylights out of kids, but in this age kids are used to viewing much worse. The movie was a little slow going in the middle. I had already ordered the book before viewing the movie and am just reading through it. I love the author’s writing style. G

Let me restate my previous comment. She may not have written the book while actively working at half-priced books. But I know she worked there!

I’m intrigued, Andrea. In what way might we be hoping for too much?And, Matthew, this Lewis guy, he wrote Children’s books? :-)TG – great to be a place of worship for you. Now, if we could spread the word…!We need to have a special blog reader Sunday – inviting the readers of our various blogs to attend services. Hmmm. 🙂

Thanks for sharing. One of them is a little scary; okay, I’ll tell you: it’s that third one!

I’m in! I’ve already got the reading schedule and book and am ready to roll.Keith

That is the most difficult thing about Calvin – the strong polemic language he uses at times. However, he was a product of his times, and I believe that we cannot emulate him in this (as I’ve heard some attempt to do). It would be akin to importing the boisterousness of the British Parliament into the US Senate. Culture needs to be taken into account.

Yep.

You all haven’t seen me recently, have you.

I actually found that quote from the Institutes in Jerram Barrs’s book “Echoes of Eden.” (pg.23) I think anybody interested in this subject would benefit from reading this book, when it is published (I don’t think it is yet…I just have a copy of the manuscript)

How cool! I was just thinking the other day that I’d like to have a project of reading more Calvin this year — though, I’m not sure I’m ready to tackle read-through-the-Institutes. . .I’ve listened to the better part of Prof. Calhoun’s lectures on Calvin, and highly recommend them. . .

I know I’m going on a rabbit trail, but since Randy mentioned the British parliament, one of my peeves is that Congress doesn’t engage in real debate. All we hear on C-Span is committees questioning people, or members taking turns talking about their position on issues, with an inordinate amount of time figuring out how much time they have used on a particular topic. I’d like to see our president engage congress in debate the way the British PM debates members of parliament.G

Have you considered drawing up a through-the-NT-in-a-year plan?Though, to be honest, I think I’m going to print out and utilize the Bible Reading Plan for Shirkers and Slackers by Margie Haack.

oh- this brings visions of the slightly slimy, cold and congealed insides of the wrapper after the sausage is gone. What a great word picture!

I met a theology student in the ’50s who was reading the institutio in Latin. Now, THAT takes a lot of perseverance and linguistic ability–to say the least.G

Like you said. . . touching the heart and mind. . . that’s what drives me to worship.

Now THERE is a great fantasy…. But, yes, Barb would love to do the puzzles.

Interesting comment by this writer on the mania over these books. I’ve read of older women – I mean 30-40ish – who are gushing devotees, which I’m at a loss to understand.I was struck by the description of the decal showing a heart in female hands and the accompanying words. I much prefer the Calvin College logo and theme: My heart I offer to you Lord, promptly and sincerely. It’s a quotation from John Calvin and on college gear and clothing usually written in Latin: Cor meum tibi offero Domine, prompte et sincere. It shows a heart in an outstretched hand.–ae

If I were – and thanks very much 🙂 – I possibly might gush, but I think it would be over different literature. My concern, though I have not read the book(s), is that because they are [reportedly] “clean” they will be considered Christian fiction. Sorry, but that’s a term I shudder at anyway. Oops, my bias is showing.–ae

I haven’t read these books. . . yet probably will at some point, mostly because of the hype around them and to be able to talk with some of the people in my life who are real fans.I thought this article from Prof. Jones was very interesting:Vampires and Young Female DesireIt raises some yellow flags that I think are worth considering. . .

“…WAS NOT INJURED!?!” What about his pride? To say nothing of the dangers of hypothermia – Br-r-r-r!Afraid I’m adding insult to injury by LOL. –ae

Btw, the McNeill/Battles edition is being made available online for a limited time, thanks to Westminster John Knox at this site:http://www2.ptsem.edu/ConEd/Calvin/They are also providing daily audio portions.

“I have converted them all to audiobook format.”I’m impressed. You’ve got mad tech skillz.”However, be warned that the audio changes Calvin so that he writes as one who is gender inclusive.”I’ve heard it is only for when that reader is recording, and it isn’t when there are other readers.Personally, I find it annoying. While I think that inclusive language is beneficial in many contexts, I like to think that most people are smart enough and stable enough to take references to “man” and understand them to be all humankind, when reading older works.

You’ve got mad tech skillz.No, I’ve got software. Audiobook Builder

Up From Slavery, Booker T. Washington’s autobiography, is outstanding. I read it a few months ago and was struck by the incredible character of the man. Staci

Up from Slavery, going on my list.Don’t necessarily put Truman on your list. I’m reading it… not necessarily recommending it.I do recommend the Dungy bio, though. Just finished it, and with him just announcing his retirement, it is timely.

It might be important to ask: Perform where? Before what audience?

How much direct influence did Calvin have on the trials and execution of the Anabaptists? I’ve done some reading, acknowledging that much of the material I’ve read has been on Mennonite websites. There are quotes from Calvin’s letters.G

Agreed. I can just look back 15 years ago to my most active pro-life efforts and be embarrassed at some of the things I said outside the abortion clinic. Not for a sec do I regret my activism. There are only a few things I would do differently.Not that I fit in the ‘great theologians of our time’ category. G

That’s hilarious! If taking up an instrument…or anything!…was that easy, I’d do it!

This is just too funny…these wonderful eavesdropping anecdotes are keeping me sane this week…

Agreed, TG, it is interesting. But it is sometimes hard to tell whether reports like this reflect interest or ridicule. Why did this report become one of the Times’ most emailed articles?

No, I’ve gone BEYOND Joe Fox and his superstore, to the completely impersonal path of the internet. It’s sad, but so terribly convenient!

Speaking of Joe Fox (and Guilt)… In late November, my mom asked me to find out what it would cost for 9 copies of C. H. Spurgeon’s devotional: Morning and Evening. I decided to go online to check the price at our largest Christian bookstore chain, in the Toronto area. Their price: $27.00 EACH (plus tax) for a leather bound copy (and this didn’t include my time and travel costs). I then checked the online price at Chapters-Indigo. Their price: $16.87 (PLUS a further discount with my i-Rewards card and FREE shipping). Pretty hard to beat.In December, I went online to check the price of another book at the SAME Christian bookstore–but this time, I found the store had gone BANKRUPT and was selling all of their stock at reduced prices. So, after Christmas I made a trip to the store to see what they had.ALL BOOKS: $2.99!!Talk about emotional shopping. There I was, sniffing back tears as I mourned the closing of one of my favorite bookstores (and places to meet single Christian men.*grin*)…and yet, at the same time I was feeling guilty for feeling so happy about the price of the books! Even worse, while I patiently waited in the mile long lineup to pay for my treasures, an announcement was made over the PA system; “If you purchase 10 books, we will give you an additional 5 books for FREE!” YEEHA! (Sniff)Fiona

I think we don’t have enough to do when we contemplate and calculate such guilt..it is possible to be too introspective, right?;-)

I think there is a little flaw (big if you are a local shop keeper) in your comparison: Amazon doesn’t have to spend money to maintain an attractive book shop or any shop for that matter; maybe a warehouse(?), and doesn’t collect sales tax.G

That should be interesting. . . though there are a few promises I hope he either is unable to keep or chooses to compromise.

word up! i had frost all over my car, and i thought i was going to have to get out an ice scraper to get to work! gee…

i most certainly don’t–i would’ve broken my credit card!

But Fiona, where is your Christian sympathy? It is only supposed to get up to the mid fifties today. Don’t you feel our pain?

Nope. (Cry babies)I suppose this means it will be a “two blanket night” for ya’ll? :)Enjoy your hot chocolate!

Okay. Let it fly. Let Christian charity go out the window and let’s start calling names.Let me finish Elsa’s -5 degree story. Notice she walked part way to work. The ambulance took her the rest of the way…